Hey Churches, just leave Halloween alone!

[Li H'Sen Chang]

I believe you mentioned once you wanted to go back. Are you still planning to that?

I want to go back but I also want my kids to stay here and experience this opportunity of USA. It is a very hard choice for me to say where I will go because my attitude about it changed a lot through time. My main focus is getting enough to retire and then maybe best case would be keep a place here and move back part time. Long trip to make but I can see enjoying the great things of both places.

[Murfreesboro]

I think many first-generation immigrants feel torn in the same way you do, Chang. It is natural to love your place of birth, even if another place offers you more opportunity in adulthood.

Tee, I hope your post above doesn't mean you no longer intend to post here. I share many of Boogeyman's concerns, but I love hearing from everyone. And I have read the Koran, BTW. I think everyone should read it. I get tired of having people on TV tell me what it says. While I can't deny that people who call themselves Christian have at times been responsible for atrocities, I do think that the Islamic extremists are far more dangerous in today's world.

I live in an area where many of the churches tend to be fundamentalist, but I can't say that anyone here has seriously hindered my celebration of Halloween. Sure, I have friends who don't participate, and once in a while I have seen literature discouraging celebration of Halloween (twice in the last 18 years, not exactly an overwhelming assault). I chose to attend a local "Hell House" a few years back, since I was curious about it. It was of course a type of ministry or outreach--what else could one expect from a church, on church property? Once was enough for me, but I don't begrudge those people their right to put on those displays. The Hell House was not actually directed against Halloween. It was using the spirit of the season to show horrific things, but they were designed to encourage people to convert to Christianity. For example, it showed several scenes in the lives of two young people, one of whom was clearly not following the Christian path. Then there was a car accident, and both died. One young person went to Heaven, and one to Hell. The images of debauchery and sin, followed by unexpected death, were designed as a memento mori. In that sense the display was Halloweenish, but it wasn't about Halloween at all.

I just returned from a visit with family in California. I stayed with my cousin, who is a devout Episcopalian (the denomination in which I was also raised). We attended church together this past Sunday morning, which also happened to be St. Francis' Day--the congregation was encouraged to bring their pets to church for a special blessing, since St. Francis is the patron saint of animals. This cousin has an extensive collection of Day of the Dead memorabilia. Her minister, who recently visited her home, has requested her to decorate an altar in their church for Day of the Dead. So you see, not every Christian denomination is so down on Halloween and its attendant celebrations.

[scareviewzombies.com]

I dont the whole "hell house" thing many churches do for Halloween. They say Halloween is a "pagan" holiday well Christmas has "pagan" roots as well.

[Murfreesboro]

I dont the whole "hell house" thing many churches do for Halloween. They say Halloween is a "pagan" holiday well Christmas has "pagan" roots as well.

Oh, I absolutely agree that it is inconsistent for people to denounce Halloween for its pagan roots, and then decorate a Christmas tree.

I think you omitted a verb, so I am uncertain what you were intending to say about the "hell house thing." My point was that the Hell Houses with which I am familiar are not directed against the celebration of Halloween. Rather, they are using people's appetite for horror at that time of year in order to promote their Christian message. It's sort of a Christian version of a "haunted house" attraction. Naturally, it has a homiletic point--otherwise they couldn't justify it as a church-sponsored activity. If you don't like it, don't go. I myself wasn't too interested in the one I visited and have never chosen to do it again.

[Pumpkin_Man]

They all have pegan roots. Even Easter was originaly a celebration of Spring before it became a celebration of the Resurection of Christ. The only holiday that I know of, that is actualy rooted in Christianity only is Thanksgiving, and that's considered to be a secular holiday.

Mike

[Murfreesboro]

Isn't that funny about Thanksgiving? Maybe calling it "secular" isn't quite right, though. It is non-sectarian. Anyone who believes in a god can celebrate it, but I suppose, technically, an atheist couldn't--he or she wouldn't have any being to "thank." But everyone can enjoy the meal!

My understanding is that Thanksgiving came from the Puritan tradition of harvest festivals, which they had had in England, too. Of course, Samhain was also a harvest festival. I guess there is nothing more natural than a celebration once your harvest is in for the winter.

[Li H'Sen Chang]

I thought Samhain meant Lord of the Dead which implies religious belief.

[Rising Dead Man]

I think Samhain is just the original Pagan celebration. The God of the Dead thing is a misunderstanding. It confused me too.

[Pumpkin_Man]

Murf, that is exactly what Thanksgiving is. The puritans came to America to flee persecution by the Church of England, and Feasts of Thanksgiving were common in their culture, and not just at harvest time. When ever puritans felt that they needed to be thankful for, they would declare a Feast of Thanksgiving. IT was done within the home, or within the community. It was practiced any time of the year, when ever a group of puritans felt that they had something to be thankful for.

In short, the Feast of Thanksgiving was a very Christian tradition, born of a Christian religion, and our annual celebration of Thanksgiving is Completely centered around the Christian tradition of giving thanks. That's not to say that other relgions don't give th anks, too. There are a lot of references to giving thanks in the Old Testament and in other religious holy books, but it was the Christians who brought the concept to America, and celebrated the very first Feast of Thanksgiving here in the early 1600s. Of course, the Native Americans did believe in dieties and also gave thanks to those dieties, so while it's never been an EXCLUSIVE Christian concept only, it is most certainly a basic Christian tradition on which the celebration of Thanksgiving is based.

Mike

[ScarecrowJack]

I thought Samhain meant Lord of the Dead which implies religious belief.

From what I understand, Samhain means "Summer's End" in Gaelic. I will tell you from studying many Celtic myths I haven't found any God/Lord of the dead. The closest is the Welsh had a God of the underworld.

[Castle]

Suppose I'll chime in. I'm Christian and I love Halloween. Does that make me a fake/bad Christian? I don't think so. I think what God cares about, and what we all should really care about, is what's in our hearts. By that I mean if I dress up as something for Halloween or if I decorate my house with stuff, I'm not doing it with the intentions of conjuring forth some demon from the depths of hell to praise Satan is some way or another. I'm just having fun. I'm not hurting anyone, I'm not doing anything illegal, I'm not direspecting God, and I'm not disrespecting my fellow Christians (though I'm sure the majority of them would feel differently about that). So when churches flip out and try to ban Halloween all together or even just ban Halloween decorations, it pisses me off. They're misinterpreting the purpose of Halloween.

[Pumpkin_Man]

Castle, the thing is, Halloween was NEVER associated with satan or hell. IT was a Pegan observance that the Druids of ancient Ireland practiced, long before they ever even heard of satan or hell. And then the Catholic Church made it All Hallows Eve, and the following day, All Saints Day, a Holy Day of Obligation. That means that every Catholic is required to attend Mass on All Saints Day. Then Nov 2nd was called All Souls Day, and while it's not a Holy Day of Obligation, it is considered to be the day that we pray for all dearly departed, not just those in heaven. It more or less took the place of the Pegan 3 day festival that the druides observed at that time of the year. So it was first a Pegan, and then a Christian observance. It was NEVER a satanic observance.

Mike

[Li H'Sen Chang]

Thanks for your post on Lord of the Dead. I thought Samhain meant Lord of Dead because in Halloween 2 Dr Loomis talked about it in the school but I never research it on my own so the lesson is not rely on horror movies for facts!

[scareviewzombies.com]

Castle, the thing is, Halloween was NEVER associated with satan or hell. IT was a Pegan observance that the Druids of ancient Ireland practiced, long before they ever even heard of satan or hell. And then the Catholic Church made it All Hallows Eve, and the following day, All Saints Day, a Holy Day of Obligation. That means that every Catholic is required to attend Mass on All Saints Day. Then Nov 2nd was called All Souls Day, and while it's not a Holy Day of Obligation, it is considered to be the day that we pray for all dearly departed, not just those in heaven. It more or less took the place of the Pegan 3 day festival that the druides observed at that time of the year. So it was first a Pegan, and then a Christian observance. It was NEVER a satanic observance.

Mike

Bingo you nailed it!

[scareviewzombies.com]

I dont the whole "hell house" thing many churches do for Halloween. They say Halloween is a "pagan" holiday well Christmas has "pagan" roots as well.

Oh, I absolutely agree that it is inconsistent for people to denounce Halloween for its pagan roots, and then decorate a Christmas tree.

I think you omitted a verb, so I am uncertain what you were intending to say about the "hell house thing." My point was that the Hell Houses with which I am familiar are not directed against the celebration of Halloween. Rather, they are using people's appetite for horror at that time of year in order to promote their Christian message. It's sort of a Christian version of a "haunted house" attraction. Naturally, it has a homiletic point--otherwise they couldn't justify it as a church-sponsored activity. If you don't like it, don't go. I myself wasn't too interested in the one I visited and have never chosen to do it again.

I did leave out the verb by accident